Just what she needs: Clinton Scandal

Just what she needs right now!

From NPR

Edited: Just to be clear, this story did NOT break three months ago; it is a new story involving the sale of donor lists to the company in question, not Bill's involvement with the company in question or the free airplane flights that they gave Hillary.

"Election 2008
Clintons' InfoUSA Ties Scrutinized

by Peter Overby

Audio for this story will be available at approx. 7:00 p.m. ET

All Things Considered, February 13, 2008 · Political campaigns spend thousands, even millions of dollars to acquire good mailing lists. But last year, Hillary Clinton took the unusual step of renting out some of her lists. The transaction highlights the Clintons' connections to a businessman who now faces questions from the Securities and Exchange Commission.

Vinod Gupta, founder of InfoUSA, a brokerage house for mailing lists, has given early and often to the Clintons' campaigns and to the Clinton library. Bill Clinton has had a lucrative business relationship with InfoUSA.

But InfoUSA has been in legal trouble for selling mailing lists to scam artists, and it's being sued by stockholders who say Gupta spends their profits to ingratiate himself to the Clintons."

That's how your candidate repays you.  By selling your information to scam artists, so that you get put on junk mail lists.  This is the respect that Clinton shows for her supporters.

Not good...



Display:


Re: Just what she needs: Clitnon Scandal (2.00 / 1)

This is going to be huge.  Just look at all the attention the story has gotten since it broke nearly three months ago.


"Another problem we have...is that in election years we behave somewhat as primitive peoples do at the time of the full moon." --Harry Truman
by Steve M on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 06:13:33 PM EST

Re: Just what she needs: Clitnon Scandal (none / 0)

I notice that you don't even attempt to defend the behavior; only indicate that you don't care about her unethical actions.

Typical


by Cycloptichorn on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 06:54:52 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Just what she needs: Clitnon Scandal (none / 0)

What I've noticed about the Clinton-haters is that they don't exactly put a lot of thought into figuring out whether something is a real scandal or not.  If it has the name Clinton on it, OMG, it must be terrible!  I see nothing here that actually needs "defending."


"Another problem we have...is that in election years we behave somewhat as primitive peoples do at the time of the full moon." --Harry Truman
by Steve M on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 07:02:03 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Just what she needs: Clitnon Scandal (none / 0)

You didn't actually read the link.  This is a new story, not the old one you linked to.


by Cycloptichorn on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 07:07:29 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Actually (none / 0)

You are wrong - this didn't come out three months ago.  Bill's involvement with the organization came out three months ago.  What DIDN'T come out was the fact that Clinton sold her donor list to the organization -

"All Things Considered, February 13, 2008 ·  Political campaigns spend thousands, even millions of dollars to acquire good mailing lists.

Last year, New York Sen. Hillary Clinton took the unusual step of renting out some of her lists. The transaction once again highlights the Clintons' connections to a businessman who now faces questions from the Securities and Exchange Commission.

Reports from Clinton's campaign show that on Dec. 3, it collected payment for renting out three mailing lists, the sale of which netted them $8,225.

It was an unusual transaction, according to Roger Craver, a liberal guru of the political direct-mail industry.

"As a general rule, a campaign will not let its donor list out into the markets until the campaign is over," he said. "This is the mother's milk of small-gift fundraising, and they use these lists frequently."

There are no records that any other presidential candidates rented out mailing lists last year.

Several sources who work in political consulting and in direct mail, who would not speak for attribution, said they were surprised by the deal, as well as its low price.

According to one direct-mail professional, $800,000 would have seemed like a more plausible price for a quality list. A political consultant suggested that the list broker's unidentified client could have rented the list as a sample one -- to do a test-run mailing."

So, she sells the info - at a bargain rate - to a company that Bill is involved in, which is under investigation for scams and junk mail?  Who happens to fly her around the country free of charge?

Nice


by Cycloptichorn on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 07:01:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Actually (none / 0)

Right.  Totally new.  Didn't come out three months ago.


"Another problem we have...is that in election years we behave somewhat as primitive peoples do at the time of the full moon." --Harry Truman
by Steve M on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 07:27:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Actually (none / 0)

NO, it did not come out three months ago.

That is the CLINTON LIBRARY donor list.  We are talking about the CLINTON CAMPAIGN donor list.

Jesus, what is it going to take to get you to RTFA?


by Cycloptichorn on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 07:30:40 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Actually (none / 0)

You seriously think that makes it a whole new scandal?  Given how the campaign is going, it's just bizarre that you're so desperate.


"Another problem we have...is that in election years we behave somewhat as primitive peoples do at the time of the full moon." --Harry Truman
by Steve M on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 07:38:54 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Actually (none / 0)

Yes, it's a new scandal.  Plenty of people here apparently weren't aware that Clinton was selling their names and addresses to scam artists.

Yaknow, it doesn't matter to me what sort of adjectives you wish to use.  I read about it, and posted it here.  If you don't want to talk about it, don't.  I will continue to do so.


by Cycloptichorn on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 07:41:32 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Actually (none / 0)

Is "selling the donor list" equivalent to laundering money from the illegal sale of arms, to terrorists?

I guess we will find out.


by Marsha1 on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 11:01:18 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Just what she needs: Clitnon Scandal (none / 0)

Actually --

same players.  different scandal.

Or at least - new wrinkle to an ongoing scandal.

But don't feel bad - I have trouble keeping up myself.


by zonk on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 07:06:37 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Just what she needs: Clitnon Scandal (none / 0)

Actually a lot of the the Vinny Gupta stuff is at least 1 year old.  I'm also disappointed to see yet another diary with nothing substantially new.  

But on the other hand, I'm disturbed by how many of our politicians get into these types of relationships with big money.  I think they get farther from understanding real life for ordinary people and it is part of our political disfunction that leads to money undermining the will of voters.

I for one continue to watch this story.  I think it is hung up in the legal process now with the shareholders' lawsuit.

 You may need to register, but these are interesting:

Motley Fool:
http://www.fool.com/investing/general/20 07/06/14/disinformation-usa.aspx

http://www.fool.com/investing/general/20 05/09/07/coup-du-jour-at-infousa.aspx

New York Times:
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/05/20/busine ss/20tele.html?ex=1337313600&en=38f9 ae54aac348d4&ei=5090

Washington Post:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/con tent/article/2007/05/25/AR2007052502332. html


by Satya on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 07:49:42 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Just what she needs: Clitnon Scandal (none / 0)

What do you mean by "hung up"?


by HillaryKnight08 on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 07:55:37 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Just what she needs: Clitnon Scandal (none / 0)

It's been 1-2 months since I've looked at details but there is a shareholder lawsuit in process and there is some probing from the SEC.


by Satya on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 08:20:21 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Your links are all broken. (none / 0)

Why does this seem to happen so often in this diary?

Here are the fixed ones:
http://www.fool.com/investing/general/20 07/06/14/disinformation-usa.aspx

http://www.fool.com/investing/general/20 05/09/07/coup-du-jour-at-infousa.aspx

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/05/20/busine ss/20tele.html?ex=1337313600&en=38f9 ae54aac348d4&ei=5090

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/con tent/article/2007/05/25/AR2007052502332. html


John McCain
by MILiberal on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 08:26:16 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Your links are all broken. (none / 0)

Thanks.

I actually stumbled onto this story during some of my investment research in tech companies.  InfoUSA is not a company I would ever invest in with Vinny Gupta at the head.


by Satya on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 08:31:54 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Just what she needs: Clitnon Scandal (none / 0)

Sorry but I probably did not answer your question.  As a non-lawyer, for me "hung up" is nearly synonymous with "in the legal process".  The shareholder's lawsuit has been going on for some time.


by Satya on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 08:25:53 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Just what she needs: Clitnon Scandal (none / 0)

Since it happened 3 months ago, I guess it doesn't matter that she sold donor information.

This + Hsu + Nafta = Iraq War vote + Iran vote + Bills ties to brutal Kazahk dictator uranium mining + huge lobbyist donore = Don't worry, she's not the establishment candidate.


M Hussein Garvey
by MGarvey on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 06:18:43 PM EST

Re: Just what she needs: Clitnon Scandal (2.00 / 1)

I just don't want to see you guys get overly excited like you did over the Kazakhstan thing, which I'm sure is going to grab the public interest any day now.  Just wait until the public realizes that Bill Clinton's charitable foundation is fighting worldwide AIDS with money that originally came from a brutal dictator!!!

I'm certainly not trying to stop you guys from talking amongst yourself about how all of this stuff is horrible, simply horrible.


"Another problem we have...is that in election years we behave somewhat as primitive peoples do at the time of the full moon." --Harry Truman
by Steve M on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 06:22:06 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Just what she needs: Clitnon Scandal (none / 0)

Does it really not bother you that the ex-President is acting as a lobbyist for a Canadian corporation which ended up netting them 3 billion dollars?  


by Piuma on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 07:52:14 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Just what she needs: Clitnon Scandal (none / 0)

I would not go so rapidly to sanctimony. You have not been concerned that your candidate, who promises a new politics of hope, gave FOUR DIFFERENT accounts to dealings with Tony Rezko. From political corruption he doesn't appear innocent either.


by HillaryKnight08 on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 07:59:23 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Just what she needs: Clitnon Scandal (none / 0)

Can you edit your headline?  This is not a good typo to just ignore.


by lizpolaris on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 06:46:26 PM EST

Re: Just what she needs: Clitnon Scandal (none / 0)

hahah, thanks for the catch!


by Cycloptichorn on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 06:54:14 PM EST
[ Parent ]

The sad state (none / 0)

So many scandals -- they no longer have any punch.

Vote Clinton: Unlike Obama, we know she's unscrupulous!


by zonk on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 07:09:20 PM EST

Re: Just what she needs: Clinton Scandal (none / 0)

Shucks, give it a rest.  I'm not above posting the occasional snarky diary about Hillary myself but all this tit-for-tat scandalous stuff is pretty pointless at this stage, don't you think?  And this story is stale, anyhow.


by Shaun Appleby on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 07:14:30 PM EST

Re: Just what she needs: Clinton Scandal (none / 0)

Sorry, but as I said in the other thread, it isn't stale - it is a new story.


by Cycloptichorn on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 07:15:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Just what she needs: Clinton Scandal (none / 0)

Yeah, I take your point.  No big deal one way or the other to me but I was hoping to see some reconciliation starting to happen with Hillary supporters here before long.  It may be a 'false hope.'


by Shaun Appleby on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 07:34:39 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Gotta give some (none / 0)

to get some.

Most of the supporters of either candidate here have been pretty cool, but I must say that many of the die-hard Clintonites have been exhibiting atrocious behavior over the last few weeks.


by Cycloptichorn on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 07:37:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Just what she needs: Clinton Scandal (none / 0)

When I read this, I felt like I was punched in the stomach. I still believe Hillary is a good lady, but please tell me this can't be true.

By the way, why doesn't the link work anymore?


by HillaryKnight08 on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 07:17:02 PM EST

Not sure why the link doesn't work (none / 0)

Here's a fixed link, though.


John McCain
by MILiberal on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 07:22:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Not sure why the link doesn't work (none / 0)

I don't know what to believe. If this is true, this could end her campaign. I'm hoping that it isn't. But then again, my hope could be false. Does anyone know anything else about this?


by HillaryKnight08 on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 07:25:42 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Not sure why the link doesn't work (none / 0)

As I noted above, this has been known for three months, and it hasn't ended her campaign yet, or even made a splash.


"Another problem we have...is that in election years we behave somewhat as primitive peoples do at the time of the full moon." --Harry Truman
by Steve M on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 07:28:04 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Not sure why the link doesn't work (none / 0)

Yes, but they're saying that there has been some knew information on it. Apparently, she sold her donor list before the end of her campaign. Trust me, I don't want to believe it, but is seems believable. I just don't want it to be true.


by HillaryKnight08 on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 07:30:03 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Not sure why the link doesn't work (none / 0)

This is about the donor list from her 2006 Senate campaign, not her donor list from this presidential campaign.  You need to be careful when reading these hit diaries, they often play fast and loose with the truth.


"Another problem we have...is that in election years we behave somewhat as primitive peoples do at the time of the full moon." --Harry Truman
by Steve M on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 07:41:07 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Not sure why the link doesn't work (none / 0)

No, I'm pretty sure that's a lie.  

B/c he didn't pay her for over a year.  Why?  The NPR article points this out in kind language at the bottom.


by Cycloptichorn on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 07:42:20 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Does that even matter? (none / 0)

If anything, this makes it even worse - that she's selling the list of her most loyal supporters, who raised her ~$40+ million before she even announced her candidacy for president.


John McCain
by MILiberal on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 07:50:44 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Not sure why the link doesn't work (none / 0)

Fine.

Let a reporter ask her that question at the next debate.

"Senator Clinton, you claim to have raised $10 million off the Internet through small donations.  Can you state unequivocally right now that their personal information will never be sold to a third party."

This has everything to do with Hillary and nothing to do with her.  This is about the small-donor strategy that Dean created, Obama exploited and Hillary is just now realizing.  Its critical to our long-term strategy and anything that allows people to cast a cynical eye toward it is destructive to us.


by ChrisR on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 07:56:54 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Not sure why the link doesn't work (none / 0)

You'll also notice that the diarist claims repeatedly that Clinton sold her list to scam artists, which isn't what the link actually says.  Again, you have to use your independent judgment in reading these things, people love to make stuff up and assume the worst whenever the Clintons are involved.  You need to look for actual evidence and not be snookered by insinuations with no basis in fact.


"Another problem we have...is that in election years we behave somewhat as primitive peoples do at the time of the full moon." --Harry Truman
by Steve M on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 07:48:23 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Not sure why the link doesn't work (none / 0)

You are very right. I can be very naive and that isn't good. I remember reading about the "push poll" incident in the Los Angelos Times. It turned out to be a lie.


by HillaryKnight08 on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 07:53:18 PM EST
[ Parent ]

See post below. (none / 0)

I wouldn't call them scam artists myself, but the author is not necessarily incorrect in doing so.


John McCain
by MILiberal on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 07:57:18 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Connect the dots. (none / 0)

The link says that Clinton sold her list to infoUSA.

What do we know about infoUSA? According to the New York Times, they indeed have a record of selling email lists to scam artists. InfoUSA has denied these allegations, but the author is perfectly legitimate in making these allegations.


John McCain
by MILiberal on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 07:54:47 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Not sure why the link doesn't work (none / 0)

Actually, the link does say that InfoUsa has been selling lists to scam artists, and is in trouble for it.

Please - RTFA before you post!!!


by Cycloptichorn on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 08:09:40 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Actually, (none / 0)

I don't think its in the link you gave.

I did link to a news article that reported it.


John McCain
by MILiberal on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 08:16:07 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Not sure why the link doesn't work (none / 0)

You noted incorrectly.


by Cycloptichorn on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 07:31:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Just what she needs: Clinton Scandal (none / 0)

Maybe I'm wishful thinking, but it seems to me that they took the story down. Maybe it was a fake?


by HillaryKnight08 on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 07:21:00 PM EST

Not really (none / 0)

See above. The author's link was somehow broken, the story's still there.


John McCain
by MILiberal on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 07:23:04 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Not really (none / 0)

Link fixed, thnx


by Cycloptichorn on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 07:25:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Not really (none / 0)

I figured. This cannot be good for Senator Clinton.


by HillaryKnight08 on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 07:26:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Still not fixed (none / 0)

The problem is that your link is just directing people to http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story (which is what I see when I hover my mouse over it), even though the actual link it displays is correct.


John McCain
by MILiberal on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 07:32:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Sigh (none / 0)

Fixed for real now.

I'm too tired to be posting...

thnx!


by Cycloptichorn on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 07:35:42 PM EST
[ Parent ]

This story is important (2.00 / 0)

because it was going to happen eventually.  I guessed someone else would do it.

Hey, we in the Democratic Party rely upon small donors off the Internet.  The minute that we start selling our donor lists for the highest bidder, it really hurts us as a Party.  This creates cynicism re:  where our personal information goes.

I love the fact that $50 and $100 donations can suprass a few $2000 donations.  Its good for democracy and Democrats.  What Hillary's campaign did is destructive to that.

And I don't care about the effect it has on the campaign and I would write the same if it were Obama.  This is just dead wrong.


by ChrisR on Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 07:37:22 PM EST


You are not logged in.

In order to post a comment, you must be logged in. If you have a member account, please log in to comment.

If not, you can make an account right here. It's quick and free.